Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

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Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by GD on Tue 25 Nov 2008, 6:57 pm

THE UK Chancellor fired a warning shot across the bows of off-shore tax havens yesterday as he announced a major review of how they transact business.
In a pre-budget report designed to show that he was taking robust action to address the fallout of the credit crisis, Alistair Darling said that jurisdictions would have to show that their tax regimes met international standards. The review, he added, would not examine the constitutional relationship between the UK and Jersey, Guernsey and the Isle of Man.
‘The recent financial turbulence has highlighted potential problems with overseas territories and Crown dependencies such as the Isle of Man and the Channel Islands,’ said Mr Darling. ‘They attract banking customers with lower taxes without contributing to the United Kingdom Exchequer.’
And in what is likely to have been an oblique reference to the Isle of Man’s request to the Treasury to help them compensate savers who lost their cash as a result of the collapse of Kaupthing Singer & Friedlander, Mr Darling added: ‘At times of stress, depositors need to know who will compensate them. The British taxpayer cannot be expected to be the guarantor of last resort.’
Within a short time of Mr Darling’s comments being broadcast, senior Jersey politicians were playing down their significance. They said that the review was good news for Jersey as it would be an opportunity to show how well regulated the Island was as a finance centre. The more high-profile the review was, the better, as Jersey would come out head and shoulders above the majority of its competitors. (from thisisguernsey)

mmm I think this could mean some big changes in the finance world in the Islands...


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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by GD on Tue 25 Nov 2008, 7:02 pm

‘Six months of hell’ prediction




FINANCE industry specialists are predicting ‘six months of hell’ as the UK government probes the Island’s crisis management, international co-operation, tax arrangements and transparency.
The review announced by UK Chancellor Alistair Darling in yesterday’s pre-budget speech is the latest in a series of reviews that have sapped the Island’s resources both in time and effort. Jersey’s financial regulation is currently undergoing an in-depth examination by the International Monetary Fund, and the UK Treasury Select Committee of MPs in September began an independent review of the three Crown Dependencies, prompted by recent international banking failures.
The last time the UK government commissioned a review of this nature was in 1998. The Edwards report, as it became known, concluded that Jersey was in the top division of offshore centres and had a clear commitment to defeating money laundering. Officially Jersey’s finance industry is heralding this latest review as an ‘opportunity’. Geoff Cook, chief executive at promoters Jersey Finance, said: ‘Our standards of compliance and governance are world class and we have the facts to prove this.’
John Riva, head of tax at KPMG, said the worst that might happen this time around would be if the UK government were to focus on Jersey’s ability to bail out the banking sector, given the size of the finance sector in relation to the rest of the economy. ‘Basically this is nonsense, because we do not have Channel Islands banks – they are all subsidiaries of major banking institutions based elsewhere. It is not Jersey that has to bail them out, but their parent country. My personal feeling is that we will have six months of sheer hell. It was the same with the Edwards report – it really shook us up, accelerated legislation we had until then only been thinking about.’
(from thisisjersey)

Is the writing on the wall....


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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by Digger on Tue 25 Nov 2008, 8:22 pm

I don't know what all you peeps are worried about Two-Thumbs has it all under control "who needs experts" he is off to the UK (hell this guy has more air miles than Richard Branson) at the end of this week to let them know the error of their ways .

We are Saved , Saved i tell you.


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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by st_ouennais on Tue 25 Nov 2008, 11:02 pm

I have seen various people try to play down the importance of this and Obama's comments on tax havens (offshore finance centres). It seems to be assumed that because we have regulation, and we are not the worst, we'll not be affected badly. Wrong. This is big boys politics we are talking here.

With both the UK and US economies looking to be in an accelerating downward spiral, the politicians need a scape goat - someone to hang out to dry and carry the can for it all. The traditional method of having an international spat or war is out of the question this time. If anything the commitments are to getting out of Iraq and Afghanistan.

Pointing the finger and applying the boot to tax havens, real or perceived, is the obvious move. We are the fall guys when the extraordinary measures and huge tax hikes necessary to pay for them are implemented, all in persuit of the lost cause of trying to keep growth on the horizon.


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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by Chok Dee Ja on Wed 26 Nov 2008, 12:39 am

Like Richard Murphy has been saying for years, The Channel Islands have their bits of paper in place but this does not mean they can operate a satisfactory regulatory jurisdiction,oh how these words are beginning to look wise.

Lets hope the views of Richard Murphy are also similar to the obama and eu goverments wide ranging changes are needed to rid the world of TAX EVASION, MONEY LAUNDERING, ARMS FINANCE DEALS AND EVERY OTHER FINANCIAL CRIME THAT GOES ON IN THE WORLDS FINANCIAL CENTRES.

BRING IT ON :)

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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by GD on Wed 26 Nov 2008, 8:54 pm

CHIEF Minister Lyndon Trott was told on Friday of the UK Government’s pending review of financial operations in offshore territories and Crown Dependencies.
Deputy Trott said the Ministry of Justice had informed him of the move, and he believed Guernsey had nothing to fear.
‘The world financial services industry has changed enormously and is barely recognisable to what it was a year ago,’ he said. ‘The political and economic climate has changed and I see the review as an opportunity for us.’
The timing was useful because it came on the back of submissions the island had made to the UK Treasury Select Committee and ahead of the January visit from representatives of the International Monetary Fund.
‘It means that much of the things that will be demanded of us will already be in place.’
Deputy Trott and States chief executive Mike Brown expect to meet representatives from the ministry in London tomorrow to discuss the review’s terms of reference. (from thisisguernsey)

Lets hope that Mr Trott has got it, but he did say that the Island would not be affected by recession....


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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by Digger on Thu 27 Nov 2008, 8:10 pm

I really cannot understand this man , the whole world is in recession so what does this gifted man know that everyone on the planet doesn't.

"Incredible".


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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by GD on Tue 09 Dec 2008, 7:18 pm

Offshore finance centres are to blame for crisis, says Pope



By Nick Mann


THE Pope has put most of the blame for the international financial crisis on offshore centres such as Guernsey.
Benedict XVI is the latest high profile leader to turn the spotlight on the Crown Dependencies in the wake of the global economic turmoil.
His message came in a reflection paper from the Holy See in which he estimated that the global fiscal deficit caused by offshore activities could amount to £175bn - more than three times the amount of global development aid.
‘To achieve a new financial agreement, a necessary first step should be to study carefully the hidden but crucial role of the offshore financial system in the light of the emergence of the global financial crisis and the inadequacy of development funding,’ the paper said.
‘Offshore markets were a significant factor in spreading the current financial crisis as they have given support to imprudent economic and financial practices. But they have also played a significant role in the imbalances of development, allowing a gigantic flight of capital linked to tax evasion. Offshore markets could also be linked to the recycling of profits from illegal activities.’ (from thisisguernsey)


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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by Thistle on Tue 09 Dec 2008, 7:25 pm

that coming from one of the richest churches in the world.wonder where they have stored their millions.
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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by Chok Dee Ja on Tue 09 Dec 2008, 7:54 pm

Thistle wrote:that coming from one of the richest churches in the world.wonder where they have stored their millions.

What are you suggesting ?

The vatican is a independant state in its own rights.

Vatican City has an autonomous government, complete with a national currency, post office and flag. The Catholic pope resides here as both a political and religious leader. The Catholic Church desires the maintenance of this state so that no nation may claim the pope for its own and thus attempt to influence or control the Church via political means.

The catholic church are a lot more switched on than you may suggest,go back to this detailed report in 2006

http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/justpeace/documents/rc_pc_justpeace_doc_20060921_lotta-corruzione_en.html

A extract from the above
A ready climate for corruption is fostered by a lack of transparency in international finances, by the existence of financial havens and by the disparity between the level at which corruption is fought — often limited to the level of single States — and the level at which corruption is carried out, usually at the supranational and international levels. It is also facilitated by limited cooperation between States in the fight against corruption, by the excessive differences in the norms of various legal systems, by the lack of media coverage of corruption in parts of the world, and by the lack of democracy in various countries. Without a free press, without democratic systems of checks and balances, without transparency, corruption is made that much easier.
Corruption is a cause of great concern today, in that it is also connected to drug-trafficking, to money-laundering, to the illegal trade of arms, and to other forms of criminality.

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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by Troy McClure on Wed 10 Dec 2008, 1:42 am

Well he can f*ck right off.

Sure, Guernsey and Jersey's financial service industries are the reason the worlds in a mess... and religion has nothing to answer for? what about the non-religious groups this particular Pope has been a member of in the past, guilt free?

As far as I can tell Jersey's taxation system has always been devised to best pay for the services the inhabitants of Jersey required, and yes being a small community does ease a certain burden of infrastructure. But where the two most significant changes to our income tax systems in the last hundred years? Oh year the war, which if I recall history correctly wasn't our doing; and external pressure from the EU to fall into line with countries who had not been able to manage their own finances as well as us in the past.

So the Pope doesn't agree with tax dodging ais? Good, now I assume he'll agree to Churches paying their Parish Rates and handing over 20% of their income from weddings etc.

And I'll agree with the bemoaning of a lack of democracy from the last section, I agree that we should have a more democratic States Assembly... lets kick the unelected Dean out for starters.

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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by Chok Dee Ja on Wed 10 Dec 2008, 6:49 am

The difference is The Catholic Church is operating within the law,money launderers,tax evaders,arms finance etc etc and the international finance jurisdictions were these funds are placed illegaly is the issue raised.They are acting in a unlawful manner.

You have obviously not read your

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Have a pleasant day :)

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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by Troy McClure on Wed 10 Dec 2008, 9:29 am

Chok Dee Ja wrote:The difference is The Catholic Church is operating within the law,money launderers,tax evaders,arms finance etc etc and the international finance jurisdictions...
So the Catholic Church act within the both the letter and the spirit of the law, including all the anti-discrimination laws? I wonder how many applications by female of gay candidates get turned down based not on merit to become clergy?

And to argue that the Church is better than a list or criminals, because they're criminals, is just meaningless waffle. Why include an international finance centre in that list; unless you can prove that it's unregulated? just to muddy their reputation without proof.

I did read through most of the link you posted, but I couldn't be bothered wasting my time on finishing it as it started using the 'fact' that God created everything as a basis that all things belonged in common to man.

I don't except any theory that has a basis on one churches faith that their unproven God was the creator of everything; I don't believe in God, and I don't take the Bible as any kind of authority, it's a work or fiction.

If others want to believe in it fine, but I don't want them thinking they can then use it to impinge or belittle anybody else or the way in which they live their lives.

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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by wayside on Wed 10 Dec 2008, 11:02 am

Troy McClure wrote:Well he can f*ck right off.


I am sure I have read that you can be sent to hell for saying that :-)
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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by Chok Dee Ja on Wed 10 Dec 2008, 11:03 am

My comment "acting within the law" is regarding the topic concerned,i dont believe in religion either but i do respect peoples choices and opinions,ive also never felt belittled or impinged by any religious comments ,they try to put across their message in the same way as most establishments do,a bit like the gfsc happy rhetoric machine going around the world holding seminars saying we are the best come and do business with us.

Then when the crunch comes they dont have adequate protection for investors or a facility to deal with bad advice,maybe the general public should be made more aware of the lack of protection.

Regarding regulation,Richard Murphy hits the nail on the head with his comment "Guernsey may have the bits of paper in place BUT ARE THEY CAPABLE OF REGULATING ?

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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by Chok Dee Ja on Wed 10 Dec 2008, 11:07 am

wayside wrote:
Troy McClure wrote:Well he can f*ck right off.


I am sure I have read that you can be sent to hell for saying that :-)


The current punishment is three hail marys and a weeknd in guernsey

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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by Troy McClure on Wed 10 Dec 2008, 2:03 pm

I'll take hell

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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by Chok Dee Ja on Wed 10 Dec 2008, 2:16 pm

Troy McClure wrote:I'll take hell


I thought you had already ? :)

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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by plimmerton811 on Wed 10 Dec 2008, 7:09 pm

"The recent financial turbulence has highlighted potential problems with overseas territories and Crown dependencies such as the Isle of Man and the Channel Islands,’ said Mr Darling. ‘They attract banking customers with lower taxes without contributing to the United Kingdom Exchequer."

Part of the first post is above, it would seem that the Cof the Ex' is more concerned that we do not pay towards the UK exchequer. He does not appear to condemn Gsy for attracting customwers because of lower taxes it is just that he doesn't get his cut.

Something has to be done to rid the world of "TAX EVASION, MONEY LAUNDERING, ARMS FINANCE DEALS AND EVERY OTHER FINANCIAL CRIME THAT GOES ON IN THE WORLDS FINANCIAL CENTRES" and the CI are doing their best to keep this dirty money out but you have to remember that the better the system, the better the reputation in the industry and therefore the more credibility laundered funds have on integration, the third stage of money laundering. So for a criminal it is an added advantage to beat the system by lying and subterfuge and have the funds in the CI if they can get them in and believe me many try and are turned away.

As for arguing religion forget it. The catholic church is not squeaky clean, far from it. You can tell a catholic area by the poverty of its people and the splendour of the magnificent church.

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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by Simple Me on Wed 10 Dec 2008, 10:12 pm

The Pope is only a Front man for the mafia, The Mafia hates the Islands because they wont take "Dirty" money

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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by Chok Dee Ja on Thu 11 Dec 2008, 12:59 am

Simple Me wrote:The Pope is only a Front man for the mafia, The Mafia hates the Islands because they wont take "Dirty" money



Any proof to back your comments up

The islands wont take dirty money,that surely is a joke ?


http://www.marsgroupkenya.org/pages/stories/Kamani_brothers/index.php


http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2008/02/06/guernsey-why-has-there-been-no-investigation-of-its-rampant-money-laundering/

Extract From richard murphy

We know that last year 45,000 people in the UK, being customers of just five UK banks, made voluntary declaration of tax evasion they had undertaken using the services of banks in Jersey, Guernsey and the Isle of Man. We know that HM Revenue & Customs suspect 200,000 might be involved in that practice: that’s the number they wrote to.


What does this mean for Guernsey? According to Marty Sullivan there might be $300 billion in Guernsey for the purposes of tax evasion. The equivalent figures are $500 billion for Jersey and $200 billion for the Isle of Man. Applying this ratio to the accounts declared (which is a broadly acceptable thing to do given the respective population sizes) suggests there may be at least 13,000 accounts in Guernsey on which tax was evaded.



But remember, that was five banks. There are 50 banks and 140 trust suppliers in Guernsey. And of course, there’s not one country using their services. So let’s take 13,000 and multiply by 10 for the number of banks and by just five for the number of countries to allow for the fact that the UK is a major user of the place. That suggests at least 650,000 bank accounts on which tax evasion is taking place. You can see how Sullivan gets to his figures. And this assumes that 45,000 was the right number of evaders: I bet there were more.



My point is this: if I’m only right about the 13,000 accounts this is a catastrophic failure by the financial services industry to identify criminal money laundering taking place within its jurisdiction. If it’s 650,000 then that’s not catastrophic just for Guernsey, it’s disastrous for us all. And there’s no reason to presume otherwise: after all, Ireland had already proven how rampant abuse was by its citizens in the same places.

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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by Chok Dee Ja on Thu 11 Dec 2008, 1:11 am

plimmerton811 wrote:"The recent financial turbulence has highlighted potential problems with overseas territories and Crown dependencies such as the Isle of Man and the Channel Islands,’ said Mr Darling. ‘They attract banking customers with lower taxes without contributing to the United Kingdom Exchequer."

Part of the first post is above, it would seem that the Cof the Ex' is more concerned that we do not pay towards the UK exchequer. He does not appear to condemn Gsy for attracting customwers because of lower taxes it is just that he doesn't get his cut.

Something has to be done to rid the world of "TAX EVASION, MONEY LAUNDERING, ARMS FINANCE DEALS AND EVERY OTHER FINANCIAL CRIME THAT GOES ON IN THE WORLDS FINANCIAL CENTRES" and the CI are doing their best to keep this dirty money out but you have to remember that the better the system, the better the reputation in the industry and therefore the more credibility laundered funds have on integration, the third stage of money laundering. So for a criminal it is an added advantage to beat the system by lying and subterfuge and have the funds in the CI if they can get them in and believe me many try and are turned away.

As for arguing religion forget it. The catholic church is not squeaky clean, far from it. You can tell a catholic area by the poverty of its people and the splendour of the magnificent church.

I wouldnt call this third stage

We know that last year 45,000 people in the UK, being customers of just five UK banks, made voluntary declaration of tax evasion they had undertaken using the services of banks in Jersey, Guernsey and the Isle of Man. We know that HM Revenue & Customs suspect 200,000 might be involved in that practice: that’s the number they wrote to.

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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by gsyguy on Thu 11 Dec 2008, 1:29 am

at the endof the day if the UK didnt over tax their people then maybe they wouldnt go to other parts of the world with their money
simple tax small everone pay tax high and few pay others opt out somewhere else,simple in it like.
anda s for the pope well i cud say...................but i wont shurch power n all that cock n bull grrrr
oh by the way xmas is cancelled due to credit crash n all that so instead of tukeys n all that just do a sunday roast same thin different name in it like,oh n santa died in a slege ride acciedent rudolf add a few to many to drink...cheap crimbo this year eh guys n girls ... nuff said
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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by plimmerton811 on Thu 11 Dec 2008, 3:45 am

Chok Dee, the banks/trust co's in Guernsey are only required to ask a customer if they have declared their earnings for tax purposes and to advise them that they have to do so and unless there is an obvious link to tax evasion then there is no requirement to report. It is a totally different reporting onus to terrorist financing and money laundering of proceeds of crime that is none tax related.
I suppose if Gsy paid the UK exchequor a sum of money all would be acceptable

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Re: Channel Island Finance "Pope say they are Tax evaders"

Post by Chok Dee Ja on Thu 11 Dec 2008, 4:59 am

plimmerton811 wrote:Chok Dee, the banks/trust co's in Guernsey are only required to ask a customer if they have declared their earnings for tax purposes and to advise them that they have to do so and unless there is an obvious link to tax evasion then there is no requirement to report. It is a totally different reporting onus to terrorist financing and money laundering of proceeds of crime that is none tax related.
I suppose if Gsy paid the UK exchequor a sum of money all would be acceptable


Its not to difficult to realise why someone from uk had previously opened a bank account in the channel islands,i dont think we need to take a exam to understand this.

Your above statement is a very weak argument regarding asking if they have declared their earnings.

The fact 45000 have already admitted shows there is a weakness in the system.KYC ?

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